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Post by allthumbs56 on Jul 22, 2021 15:54:09 GMT
Pretty much every approved drug to help or cure whatever carries some kind of risk. Precisely. For the past year, there have been conflicting announcements regarding the vaccines from the experts. 'Take this. No .. don't take that. It's alright to take that now. Wait .. we're not sure about that again. Don't mix them. Um, yeah, you can mix n' match' etc. So did I. X-mas day, '19. Was down for close to three weeks. Never been that bad my entire life. Announcements by experts were also made that if one recovered from covid, then to not take the vaccine. Then changed again. Nor the vaccines. For me, and I assume many others, there is not enough valid, concrete information to make a comfortable decision at this time. I'm pretty sure I saw a study a few days ago that stated that tests are showing that the anti-bodies in previously-infected people are waning. It recommended that a single booster gets the gas tank back up to "Full". I'll have a look for it later. |
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Post by johnreardon on Jul 22, 2021 16:50:13 GMT
Source wars prove nothing when the government, MSM, and corporations in the tech sector have invested so much time and effort in selling their interpretation of how to survive this problem. If I offered anything I`m sure you could find a talking head looking for a grant, or a medical journal article to refute any claims that darken the plot. This isn`t a cop out, and I can think of a couple of very long interviews that are very compelling...but it`s pointless in my mind, casue as I said before, I think everyone has already made up their mind. I live around a group of both vaccinated and unvaccinated people. The vaccinated don`t shame the unvaccinated. The unvaccinated don`t raise doubts in the minds of those who are already vaccinated to casue them worry. It`s how we get along and respect each other. We also don`t discuss it with anyone we meet in public, it`s unnecessary, and frankly none of their business. Those who aren`t batshit crazy know we have a new disease in our midst, but it could have been handled in way in Canada that was more advantageous to the citizens. All I`m saying is don`t be too sure that the song you`re singing doesn`t come with updated lyrics down the road. I`m hesitant to speak, but some in the vaccinated majority, are becoming like a rank mob after Frankenstein. They worry me. Good day fine sir. Try me - I read up daily on what's available and I could certainly welcome anything new on the "Don't get vaccinated side" - it seems that all I get from my SIL in SC is the same things she's been posting/sending me for the past six months. Meanwhile the "Pro-vax" data seems to grow more compelling daily. I do pay attention to this stuff and chart all the trending numbers daily. My daughter in Victoria has yet to get vaccinated as she is breastfeeding. The consensus out there is that she'd probably be ok - maybe even better - but there's no data to support that. I'm all-in with her decision. I'm not some kind of - torch-carrying mob-arse. I am, however, pretty smart and lived a life of Science and data so, like I said - try me. I started checking the ‘numbers’ when it first started in Mar 2020. I used to be a statistician & there were so many mistakes by the media in the way they interpreted the data, I gave up. Even our Office of National Statistics were not infallible. To be fair to them, whenever I was asked by politicians for data, I used to ask them what they were trying to ‘prove’. It’s easy to present data in many ways to back up their arguments. They probably do the same. I just follow advice given by our Gov, in the hope that fundamentally it was backed by science. |
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Post by allthumbs56 on Jul 22, 2021 17:01:36 GMT
Try me - I read up daily on what's available and I could certainly welcome anything new on the "Don't get vaccinated side" - it seems that all I get from my SIL in SC is the same things she's been posting/sending me for the past six months. Meanwhile the "Pro-vax" data seems to grow more compelling daily. I do pay attention to this stuff and chart all the trending numbers daily. My daughter in Victoria has yet to get vaccinated as she is breastfeeding. The consensus out there is that she'd probably be ok - maybe even better - but there's no data to support that. I'm all-in with her decision. I'm not some kind of - torch-carrying mob-arse. I am, however, pretty smart and lived a life of Science and data so, like I said - try me. I started checking the ‘numbers’ when it first started in Mar 2020. I used to be a statistician & there were so many mistakes by the media in the way they interpreted the data, I gave up. Even our Office of National Statistics were not infallible. To be fair to them, whenever I was asked by politicians for data, I used to ask them what they were trying to ‘prove’. It’s easy to present data in many ways to back up their arguments. They probably do the same. I just follow advice given by our Gov, in the hope that fundamentally it was backed by science. We're having trouble speaking with our relatives in South Carolina any more. My SIL called me, Maggs, and her mom "The Walking Dead" a couple weeks ago because we've all been vaccinated. They are very much members of the "One in Five": nationalpost.com/news/world/one-in-five-americans-think-the-covid-vaccine-is-used-to-implant-microchips |
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Post by Sinster on Jul 22, 2021 17:58:20 GMT
Pretty much every approved drug to help or cure whatever carries some kind of risk. Precisely. For the past year, there have been conflicting announcements regarding the vaccines from the experts. 'Take this. No .. don't take that. It's alright to take that now. Wait .. we're not sure about that again. Don't mix them. Um, yeah, you can mix n' match' etc. You do realize this is a new virus and they are learning new things about. So they adjust their recommendations. Remember when AIDS/HIV hit the scene and that you could catch it from shaking hands or from the toilet seats. They did more research and are like whoops no you cant'.. It was only a homosexual disease, but then Ryan White caught it from a blood transfusion, ( He was shunned by his community.), and then again the change their recommendations.
Recommendations will always evolve when they discover more information about how this actually works and what it takes to defend against it. |
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Post by Sinster on Jul 22, 2021 18:06:43 GMT
As they use their phones, computers, TV, banks account, newer cars, home assistance, and etc. etc. |
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Post by laristotle on Jul 22, 2021 19:07:05 GMT
Recommendations will always evolve when they discover more information about how this actually works and what it takes to defend against it. I agree. That's why I'm taking my time to decide. |
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Post by laristotle on Jul 22, 2021 19:14:01 GMT
Well, this may certainly make me feel more comfortable. 
“You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations,” Biden said Wednesday while speaking at a televised town hall in Cincinnati, Ohio. “If you’re vaccinated, you’re not going to be hospitalized, you’re not going to be in the IC unit, and you’re not going to die,” he added.
Biden also said that he doesn’t know of any person fully vaccinated against the CCP virus who was hospitalized or has died. The president made the remark as he responded to a reporter who asked him about Americans who have been vaccinated and still contract the disease.
“It may be possible, I know of none where they’re hospitalized, in ICU and or have passed away so at a minimum I can say even if they did contract it, which I’m sorry they did, it’s such a tiny percentage and it’s not life-threatening,” the president said.
Again, his comment conflicts with the CDC’s findings that more than 5,000 vaccinated people were hospitalized and more than 1,000 died as of July 12.
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Post by Sinster on Jul 22, 2021 19:56:48 GMT
Again, his comment conflicts with the CDC’s
So did the previous administrations. It's the nature Politics, which it shouldn't be that way, but it is.
BTW what's the time stamp where they states all of this?
3:53 He states "even if you do catch the virus"
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Post by allthumbs56 on Jul 22, 2021 20:06:48 GMT
“You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations,” Biden said Wednesday while speaking at a televised town hall in Cincinnati, Ohio. “If you’re vaccinated, you’re not going to be hospitalized, you’re not going to be in the IC unit, and you’re not going to die,” he added.
Biden also said that he doesn’t know of any person fully vaccinated against the CCP virus who was hospitalized or has died. The president made the remark as he responded to a reporter who asked him about Americans who have been vaccinated and still contract the disease.
“It may be possible, I know of none where they’re hospitalized, in ICU and or have passed away so at a minimum I can say even if they did contract it, which I’m sorry they did, it’s such a tiny percentage and it’s not life-threatening,” the president said.
Again, his comment conflicts with the CDC’s findings that more than 5,000 vaccinated people were hospitalized and more than 1,000 died as of July 12.
He's almost right: "Public Health Ontario, meanwhile, found last week that a mere 0.02 per cent of fully vaccinated Ontarians have been infected by a “vaccine breakthrough” case of COVID-19. And given the province’s utterly plummeting rate of COVID-19 deaths (three days this week have seen zero fatalities), it’s safe to assume that almost all of those breakthrough cases are back to work."
nationalpost.com/health/covid-19-myths-that-refuse-to-die-from-undue-concern-about-children-to-variants-and-vaccines4999/5000 times he's right that you won't catch it if you're fully vaxxed. Given that the odds of ending up in hospital or dying (1 in 200,000+) are exponentially better than that, this may be the most-right thing that's come out of his mouth so far. |
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Post by johnreardon on Jul 23, 2021 9:24:02 GMT
“You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations,” Biden said Wednesday while speaking at a televised town hall in Cincinnati, Ohio. “If you’re vaccinated, you’re not going to be hospitalized, you’re not going to be in the IC unit, and you’re not going to die,” he added.
Biden also said that he doesn’t know of any person fully vaccinated against the CCP virus who was hospitalized or has died. The president made the remark as he responded to a reporter who asked him about Americans who have been vaccinated and still contract the disease.
“It may be possible, I know of none where they’re hospitalized, in ICU and or have passed away so at a minimum I can say even if they did contract it, which I’m sorry they did, it’s such a tiny percentage and it’s not life-threatening,” the president said.
Again, his comment conflicts with the CDC’s findings that more than 5,000 vaccinated people were hospitalized and more than 1,000 died as of July 12.
That made me laugh. We have thousands that are getting the virus after two jabs. Good news is that most have mild symptoms and are not being hospitalised. Even our own Health Secretary has got it
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Post by laristotle on Jul 23, 2021 9:59:04 GMT
Texas Democrats Face Covid Outbreak and a Stalled Voting Rights PushThe entire delegation from Texas is now stuck at a Washington hotel after six of the Democratic state representatives tested positive for the coronavirus, and an official from Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s office who met with them has also tested positive. All of those who have tested positive are fully vaccinated, but nobody in the capital is now particularly eager to meet in person with the group, which has resorted to virtual meetings.Did they share the same bottle among themselves? 
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Post by laristotle on Jul 23, 2021 10:39:19 GMT
Science Table calls for vaccine certificates they admit have no scientific backing
Basically, they want them because they want them — and it makes them feel better.
This would be the same self-appointed and overly self-important “Science Table” which has consistently botched projections for case counts of COVID and what it would take for the government to get the pandemic under control.
It’s not me saying that there is no scientific evidence for the use of “vaccine certificates” — it’s the Science Table themselves.
“There is currently no scientific evidence of the direct impact of COVID-19 vaccine certificates on SARS-CoV-2 transmission or population vaccination rates, and there are important ethical, legal, accessibility, and privacy considerations concerning their development and implementation,” the group says as they call for the government to implement this useless idea.
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 23, 2021 11:27:22 GMT
My 51 years on this planet, not once have I heard of anyone personally dying from the flu. I know seven people personally who have died or family members have died because C19.
You may not know anyone but your grandparents sure did. The Spanish Flu epidemic at the end of WWI killed between 20-50 million people... |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 23, 2021 11:28:10 GMT
Texas Democrats Face Covid Outbreak and a Stalled Voting Rights PushThe entire delegation from Texas is now stuck at a Washington hotel after six of the Democratic state representatives tested positive for the coronavirus, and an official from Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s office who met with them has also tested positive. All of those who have tested positive are fully vaccinated, but nobody in the capital is now particularly eager to meet in person with the group, which has resorted to virtual meetings.
Geez, couldn't they have gotten a better beer than Miller Lite? |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 23, 2021 11:30:51 GMT
Here's a recent observation. My wife and I both got J&J because we wanted to be done with the vaccine quickly. Now certain people have told my wife they won't hang out with her because it isn't an MRNA vax- Vaccine discrimination!
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Post by laristotle on Jul 23, 2021 12:00:04 GMT
Estimating how many Canadians mixed AstraZeneca with mRNA “There are so many Canadians who got the AstraZeneca vaccine and then got the Pfizer or Moderna because they were told to,” said Dr. Anna Banerji, infectious diseases expert at the University of Toronto.
“Once things open up, it’s going to be an issue that they have to deal with.”
Two medical experts who spoke to the Sun expect short-term confusion globally over how — and whether — to accept vaccine mixing.
In the meantime: “The people that have gotten AstraZeneca — because they were told to do it because it was the right thing to do for themselves and the community — I think a lot of them feel burned,” Dr. Banerji said.
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Post by laristotle on Jul 23, 2021 12:02:34 GMT
COVID19 vaccine mixing is leading to major travelling mix-ups “They can’t travel in October because you’re no longer considered vaccinated in the U.S. with the mixed vaccine.”
Many Canadians are in the same frustrating spot.
The cruise line the McIntosh’s booked with is among many spelling out vaccination rules on their websites.
Celebrity says “Following CDC guidelines, Celebrity will consider a guest ‘fully vaccinated’ with proof of vaccination that can include mixed doses of the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines only.
“We are in a bit of a grey area now where many places are making it up as they go along and adjusting policy as they go along,” said Dr. Isaac Bogoch of the University Health Network.
“When the dust settles I think most will go along with WHO approved vaccines, and they will also approve mixing and matching.”
“This has affected millions of Canadians,” said Dr. Anna Banerji of the Temerty Faculty of Medicine at the University of Toronto.
“And I think that if these rules stay in place you’re going to have a lot of really really angry people.”
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Post by johnreardon on Jul 23, 2021 12:07:12 GMT
My 51 years on this planet, not once have I heard of anyone personally dying from the flu. I know seven people personally who have died or family members have died because C19.
You may not know anyone but your grandparents sure did. The Spanish Flu epidemic at the end of WWI killed between 20-50 million people... In the United Kingdom, the average number of deaths from the flu is smaller than in the US. In the UK, the average deaths per year from the flu ranges from 10,000-25,000.
The Center for Disease Control estimates that there is an average of 36,000 deaths per year as a result of the flu in the United States. The highest amount of people ever killed during a single flu season in the US was 61,000.
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Post by Sinster on Jul 23, 2021 14:43:29 GMT
Two medical experts who spoke to the Sun expect short-term confusion globally over how — and whether — to accept vaccine mixing.
In the meantime: “The people that have gotten AstraZeneca — because they were told to do it because it was the right thing to do for themselves and the community — I think a lot of them feel burned,” Dr. Banerji said.Because the article states they are experts doesn't mean they are. In this day and age everyone is an EXPERT because they are Googletolgist and find the information to fit their narrative.
Just because I wind pickups doesn't make me an expert. Now Seth Lover, Lollar, Seymour etc.. etc. are the experts. If I were to tell you that those winders are full of shit people would say I'm bat shit crazy. When those winders speak the majority of guitarist listen. The experts try to get the information out there, but get flooded with all kinds of misinformation by so called experts and friends, which is always followed by links to back up their misinformation point without actually data or data that is flawed.
Me I will take my chances on the Majority of the WORLDS experts with their data rather than the minority of the experts. I'm going with the better odds. Again if you want to take your chances that your experts are 10% correct and the rest of the worlds experts at 90%. I'm going with the 90%.
We can go back and forth with this to the end of time. We will just be running in circles. You have your beliefs and I have mine. I will side with science (which is always ongoing) and mathematicians.
How about the numb nut Andrew Wakefield who said vaccine causes autism? The world went cookoo and now we have Anti-Vaxxer's.. Then to find out all his data was false. During that time majority of the experts disagreed with his findings.
I'm glad the experts really let the cat out of the bag about the Earth being flat and Man never been on the moon.
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Post by Sinster on Jul 23, 2021 14:47:02 GMT
You may not know anyone but your grandparents sure did. The Spanish Flu epidemic at the end of WWI killed between 20-50 million people... In the United Kingdom, the average number of deaths from the flu is smaller than in the US. In the UK, the average deaths per year from the flu ranges from 10,000-25,000.
The Center for Disease Control estimates that there is an average of 36,000 deaths per year as a result of the flu in the United States. The highest amount of people ever killed during a single flu season in the US was 61,000.
I'm not saying people do not die from the flu. I'm saying ME personally do not know anyone who has died from the flu or family member has died from the flu. Unlike C19 where I know 7.
The Spanish Flu was name Spanish Flu because Spain was neutral during WWI and they were free to report about it.
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 23, 2021 15:28:54 GMT
In the United Kingdom, the average number of deaths from the flu is smaller than in the US. In the UK, the average deaths per year from the flu ranges from 10,000-25,000.
The Center for Disease Control estimates that there is an average of 36,000 deaths per year as a result of the flu in the United States. The highest amount of people ever killed during a single flu season in the US was 61,000.
I'm not saying people do not die from the flu. I'm saying ME personally do not know anyone who has died from the flu or family member has died from the flu. Unlike C19 where I know 7.
The Spanish Flu was name Spanish Flu because Spain was neutral during WWI and they were free to report about it.
Yes, I understood you. Thing is, you and I are 51 and (hopefully) in good health. Add 30 years to that and stick us in nursing homes and the flu could easily turn deadly. That said, I don't usually get the annual flu shot, but I did this year- I guess I let them scare me into it... (So much for my "nerves of steel")  You and I both had covid early year and both of us came through relatively unscathed and then we both got vaccinated. Call it callous on my part but I didn't do it for the common good- I got the shot because I was afraid that we would be restricted from playing concerts without the vaccine cards and I was right because I am constantly asked to produce the card when we play. That, combined with potential summer travel plans made it a no brainer for me. In fact I need to go to Germany for a funeral in less than a week so I suppose it paid off both ways, assuming they don't close the border in the next 6 days... Everyone has reasons for getting the shot or not getting the shot. Let's just hope that the vaccine actually stands the test of time, because the numbers are not trending in the right direction right now... |
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Post by Sinster on Jul 23, 2021 18:42:07 GMT
I'm not saying people do not die from the flu. I'm saying ME personally do not know anyone who has died from the flu or family member has died from the flu. Unlike C19 where I know 7.
The Spanish Flu was name Spanish Flu because Spain was neutral during WWI and they were free to report about it.
Yes, I understood you. Thing is, you and I are 51 and (hopefully) in good health. Add 30 years to that and stick us in nursing homes and the flu could easily turn deadly. That said, I don't usually get the annual flu shot, but I did this year- I guess I let them scare me into it... (So much for my "nerves of steel") You and I both had covid early year and both of us came through relatively unscathed and then we both got vaccinated. Call it callous on my part but I didn't do it for the common good- I got the shot because I was afraid that we would be restricted from playing concerts without the vaccine cards and I was right because I am constantly asked to produce the card when we play. That, combined with potential summer travel plans made it a no brainer for me. In fact I need to go to Germany for a funeral in less than a week so I suppose it paid off both ways, assuming they don't close the border in the next 6 days... Everyone has reasons for getting the shot or not getting the shot. Let's just hope that the vaccine actually stands the test of time, because the numbers are not trending in the right direction right now... Trending not in the right directions partially because of the non vaccinated people.
Yes the vaccinated are getting it, but it's a very small percentage. As of right now here in the NorthEast the numbers are not trending up and that's because the majority of the people got their vaccine. Look where the numbers are trending those states where the majority of the people aren't vaccinated.
I got mine for the common good and I felt like I dodge a bullet and don't want to get it worse if I was to get it again.
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Post by laristotle on Jul 23, 2021 19:10:08 GMT
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 24, 2021 0:56:16 GMT
Yes, I understood you. Thing is, you and I are 51 and (hopefully) in good health. Add 30 years to that and stick us in nursing homes and the flu could easily turn deadly. That said, I don't usually get the annual flu shot, but I did this year- I guess I let them scare me into it... (So much for my "nerves of steel") You and I both had covid early year and both of us came through relatively unscathed and then we both got vaccinated. Call it callous on my part but I didn't do it for the common good- I got the shot because I was afraid that we would be restricted from playing concerts without the vaccine cards and I was right because I am constantly asked to produce the card when we play. That, combined with potential summer travel plans made it a no brainer for me. In fact I need to go to Germany for a funeral in less than a week so I suppose it paid off both ways, assuming they don't close the border in the next 6 days... Everyone has reasons for getting the shot or not getting the shot. Let's just hope that the vaccine actually stands the test of time, because the numbers are not trending in the right direction right now... Trending not in the right directions partially because of the non vaccinated people.
Yes the vaccinated are getting it, but it's a very small percentage. As of right now here in the NorthEast the numbers are not trending up and that's because the majority of the people got their vaccine. Look where the numbers are trending those states where the majority of the people aren't vaccinated.
I got mine for the common good and I felt like I dodge a bullet and don't want to get it worse if I was to get it again.
Goodness, I hope that's right that it is the unvaccinated who are getting infected and not breakthroughs. Of course I don't want ANYONE to get infected but it would be terrible if these vaccines were all for naught! I'm certainly with you there- I got off easy too and I don't really want it again |
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Post by Sinster on Jul 24, 2021 13:41:17 GMT
Trending not in the right directions partially because of the non vaccinated people.
Yes the vaccinated are getting it, but it's a very small percentage. As of right now here in the NorthEast the numbers are not trending up and that's because the majority of the people got their vaccine. Look where the numbers are trending those states where the majority of the people aren't vaccinated.
I got mine for the common good and I felt like I dodge a bullet and don't want to get it worse if I was to get it again.
Goodness, I hope that's right that it is the unvaccinated who are getting infected and not breakthroughs. Of course I don't want ANYONE to get infected but it would be terrible if these vaccines were all for naught! I'm certainly with you there- I got off easy too and I don't really want it again I agree.
161 million vaccinated, 6k breakthrough and of those 1200 deaths. Breakthrough are expected, if they weren't those ads on TV wouldn't run down the list of "common side effects include" and "even death".
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 24, 2021 13:59:20 GMT
Goodness, I hope that's right that it is the unvaccinated who are getting infected and not breakthroughs. Of course I don't want ANYONE to get infected but it would be terrible if these vaccines were all for naught! I'm certainly with you there- I got off easy too and I don't really want it again I agree.
161 million vaccinated, 6k breakthrough and of those 1200 deaths. Breakthrough are expected, if they weren't those ads on TV wouldn't run down the list of "common side effects include" and "even death".
Only 6,000 breakthroughs (in the US) is a good thing. However if I understand right, that means that 20% of the breakthrough cases wind up dying. Probably early skewed numbers but I hope it doesn't mean if it breaks through, it breaks you.... |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 14:10:57 GMT
This scenario occupies my mind at times. An individual gets vaccinated, then for whatever reason, develops Covid symptoms, becomes concerned, gets tested and tests positive.
Another individual gets vaccinated, contracts Covid, but is asymptomatic with no symptoms and never gets tested. Is anyone entertaining that possible scenario in the media?
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 24, 2021 15:27:06 GMT
This scenario occupies my mind at times. An individual gets vaccinated, then for whatever reason, develops Covid symptoms, becomes concerned, gets tested and tests positive. Another individual gets vaccinated, contracts Covid, but is asymptomatic with no symptoms and never gets tested. Is anyone entertaining that possible scenario in the media? I'd bet that if one were to be able count the number of covid cases that weren't reported because they weren't severe enough or asymptomatic, you'd see those numbers at least double or triple. And countries like China, Russia and India have certainly underreported their numbers by a wide margin. But that's simply something we will never be able to know. My friend in PA contracted covid with medium severity symptoms (wiped him out for a week but he wasn't hospitalized). His doctor refused to test him, which made absolutely no sense to me. Maybe they wanted to keep the numbers down? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 15:48:21 GMT
Yes...it appears to many that the data is being massaged and filtered. I would like to be trusting, and believe that all is wrapped in benevolence, but to me at least, that would be naive and childish.
This event does a great service in unmasking the level of corruption and disconnectedness in our social services and political watchdog class.
We talk about "systemic" everything, with the exception of "systemic corruption".
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Post by Die Bullen on Jul 24, 2021 17:43:51 GMT
The problem is that this whole thing has been used by every political party for gain. Not that this should be a surprise.
You are right, the 6000 breakthroughs out of all the vaccinated certainly is somewhat reassuring. What I meant was I find it strange that if the virus does break through, the death rate is so high
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