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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2016 0:17:11 GMT
I don't necessarily agree. I don't know many to be honest. But I will tell you negotiating with one for an apparently unimportant show (to himprobably) seemed like i was negotiating for access to fort knox. tried to get me solo for about 6 dollars more than it woudl cost meto do the gig assuming i kept my drinks down to 2. when that failed lowballed the band so bad I thought Dom (our drummer) was goingto have a stroke. i countered with a higher intial price, more in line with what we are worth,and they lowballed us again with an offer of both a "first trial run" and a "properly paid run". I countered with my second best price as introductory and a higher price than i knew they paid as my secondary. I finally got my secondary introduction price and their top price for second date.
It's a fucking dog eat dog world otu there for us musicians. If we won't do it for 250 like Ron's band,(a 4 piece)(who is now my bassist) did a year ago, some other crappy band will. we have to stand at basic bottom prices or we'll all get screwed forever.
MY FATHER would get as much per night as I woudl have gotten under this guys "princely" offer. (IN 1974!) 32 years have gone by and 100 a night is still the standard! Fuck this shit! WE gotta move it forward with the times.
And yes, I am told by my friends who play the US that you guys actually pay bands to play. But Canada is behind the times.
anywya, my asking price was their top price. 400. to be perfectly honest about numbers. they countered with 300. I countered with 350.they countered with 325 and 350 for second date. I coutnered with 350 and 450 for second. they agreed to 350 adn 400. fuck fort knox there's some serious money to be had for those that rock the shit out of places.
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Post by Bill h on Feb 7, 2016 18:55:17 GMT
Well, even though a band is hired to provide entertainment and keep people drinking, to a bar owner you are nothing but overhead plain and simple. Getting blood from a rock is a skill you must develop when dealing with them. Most places have a standard take it or leave it fee for bands but sometimes haggling with a tightwad is necessary. I've done it more then I care to remember. Some places just don't bring in a lot of people and the owner just can't afford it, so if you really want the gig you will have to bend as well. A huge help to your bands rep is a decent following. Bar owners find out your bringing in customers you will be sought after. But that takes time and a lot of grinding for the seats making shit.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2016 19:44:08 GMT
ya I hear you Bill. Ron's last band played there for 250. It helped though that Dom knew people who knew how much they paid as standard  we're aiming for the bigger venues but for this summer and this year all together, i think we'll take any gig that pays well enough one thing i learned is that it's easier to give someone a deal on a high price, than it is to raise one's price after establishing that one has a cheap price for next year we are aiming for venues of 400 plus people and a pay that is commensurate with that. i think we'll get a good following. we do the open mics and people love us. they dig the guitar playing, and they dig our choice of songs.... a few even like my voice, and everyone loves the drummer and bassist we get to test that theory for real on valentines day We have our first "professional' show, though we are doing it pro bono as it's a charity event should be a lot of peeps there we only have to play a 45 minute set and we dont have to lug much gear so it shoudl be like an open mic but longer hahhahaha anyway, i'm babbling. I'm having a blast with my guys. Can't wait to start getting paid hahahaha |
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Post by Bill h on Feb 7, 2016 21:46:09 GMT
All the other poop aside, having fun is the real reason you do it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2016 22:46:50 GMT
well, i'd like to do it to eat too hahahaha. i love playing, and i love playing for people more |
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Post by Maxwell on Feb 11, 2016 1:54:34 GMT
My theory is that there are few real club owners that actually know the club biz nowadays.... Many don't even advertise their own clubs worth a damn, much less who is playing that week...
Luckily, with my band, we don't have to play to eat as all of us are older farts and most of us are somewhat retired, but there are places that we will never play in the area. They won't pay what we want and we won't play for 'em anyway for various reasons...
There are a lot of lowballer bands out there that dick it up for other musicians by playing dirtball cheap... Dumbass club owners jump on 'em because they work for next to nothing and yet STILL wonder why they can't build up a big regular paying clientele... Dumbass lowballers don't understand why folks don't like 'em, including other bands...
Damned if I understand it... No, I do understand the situation, damned if I understand why it is the standard now...
I detest the lowballer idjits... I've seen good bands/solos/duos bumped from a confirmed schedule because of 'em... Screwing another musician will get one on my bad side in a new york heartbeat. In my days way back of making my living playing, I've handed off jobs to other bands/musicians for various reasons like being already booked for that slot. Others handed off to us too. We all wanted all of us to work (the good bands)... The Code. Club owners would call US for help filling a slot and if we needed a slot down the road, we got it... The Code. Used to be a joint venture between clubs and bands for both to fill the seats and both make money.... I guess I'm an old fart living in the past.... But damnit, it was far better back then all around....
A club I'd worked at a few years back hired one of those D tuned growling crap whatever you call that rock style... Owner told me he had a great crowd, although younger than normal crowd with lots of folks there but made no money. He didn't understand why. Duh huh... I told him they probably bought one beer all night if that much but would go drink out of the car or burn them a big doobie every break. I said 'you wanted to try this young bullshit band and you got what you wanted. You will NEVER make money on bands like this as their young friends that show up when they play have no damn money. Get bands within a genre that folks WITH MONEY like listening to...'
Oh well....
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Post by Catfish on Feb 11, 2016 17:17:24 GMT
In the thick of it right now, in Canada. Flat fee seems to be the norm. Local rep goes a long way in this particular town; the good musicians who have been here a while have the venues pretty locked up as far as booking is concerned.
The money is much better than what you're describing, however; not sure if that's because Blues, or because Saskatoon, or what.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 17:25:17 GMT
well, around here there are tons of bands and all of them want to play, most of them have day jobs and coudl care less if they are making prices lower for everyone else, bars are hiring bands because they are cheap...and that brings the price down. also depends on the gig. the bigger places will pay more. I don't completely know how it works but my drummer at least says he usually is paid more than what this guy is paying us and he has some contacts so we should do alright once people hear that we are good |
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Post by Catfish on Feb 11, 2016 17:53:49 GMT
well, around here there are tons of bands and all of them want to play, most of them have day jobs and coudl care less if they are making prices lower for everyone else, bars are hiring bands because they are cheap...and that brings the price down. also depends on the gig. the bigger places will pay more. I don't completely know how it works but my drummer at least says he usually is paid more than what this guy is paying us and he has some contacts so we should do alright once people hear that we are good Similarly, in LA. People undercutting the market because they kinda suck, but have day jobs, and just want to gig. Most booking agents care about draw and bar receipts, not music per se. Lulz. At any rate, for a fresh act that needs to showcase in order to get a draw going, you're doing alright at 350 and 4 over 2 gigs. That was well played on your end. I typically try for a percentage of the bar, which puts us in business together. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2016 0:34:16 GMT
Ya i don't think the percentage of the bar has been done here in a long while. I vaguely remember my dad talking about that but i don't know if anyone still does it. I"ll have to find out   |
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Post by Bill h on Feb 12, 2016 0:54:02 GMT
We got a piece of the door a few times at clubs that had a cover charge.
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Post by Catfish on Feb 12, 2016 14:56:40 GMT
Ya i don't think the percentage of the bar has been done here in a long while. I vaguely remember my dad talking about that but i don't know if anyone still does it. I"ll have to find out That's how LA works in the present tense, smartass. Bunch of flat-fee savages up here in Canada...  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2016 20:02:03 GMT
Ya i don't think the percentage of the bar has been done here in a long while. I vaguely remember my dad talking about that but i don't know if anyone still does it. I"ll have to find out That's how LA works in the present tense, smartass. Bunch of flat-fee savages up here in Canada... flat fees are better for bars apparently.... I'll honestly be investigating the possibility to see if it's done at all around here |
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Post by melvindale on Feb 19, 2016 20:19:44 GMT
Your pay isn't all that bad.
We play for 100.00 a man and when we added a third guitarist (I won't comment on your other thread) we were still getting the same gelt.
I bowed out of one gig they play - 30 miles one way for 80.00 in a car that takes premium - doesn't excite me much.
It's never easy trying to get owners to pay when the young'ens are willing to work for next to nothing, but we keep'em in the seats.
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