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Post by zontar on Jan 7, 2021 8:17:32 GMT
So to clarify I am referring to the machine hard/tuners, that have slots, and not a hole through the post so you attach the strings that way. Typically you attach the string at the tailpiece, pull it up to the peg & a past it--bend the end & cut it off and put the tip of the string in the slot and wind it up. This was common on Fenders at one time. Most basses use this style as well (Pulling the heavier bass strings through a hole & winding that way could be tricky) I have two guitars with these--sort of. Well, one has genuine vintage style tuners & the other has both the slots & the holes so you can use either. I used to always use the holes, until I got my Mustang where you had to sue the slots. After my first string change on that guitar, I started using the slots on the other one as well. If someone else changes the things, they end to use the holes. So any preferences? Or do you use locking tuners? I know Spell has/had a guitar with Steinberger tuners that work differently as well. You can see the hybrid style in this picture:  And the Fender style in this one:  |
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Post by johnreardon on Jan 7, 2021 10:54:45 GMT
I used to have locking tuners on the PRS guitars I had, but didn't really like them. A bit old fashioned, I prefer the old vintage stuff
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 7, 2021 12:56:11 GMT
All my guitars are different. Some have locking tuners, some just plain vintage style. I guess it depends on the guitar as to what I prefer
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Post by infant on Jan 7, 2021 14:11:58 GMT
I love the slotted Safe-T-Post tuners on my Fenders. I can change a set of strings in minutes. I ended up putting a set of vintage style Grovers with Safe-T-Posts on my Melody Maker but I have found that they don’t work as well on Gibson headstock due to the headstock angle.
All my other guitars (Martin, Ovation and ES137) have Grover Rotomatics.
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Post by johnreardon on Jan 7, 2021 14:20:07 GMT
I love the slotted Safe-T-Post tuners on my Fenders. I can change a set of strings in minutes. I ended up putting a set of vintage style Grovers with Safe-T-Posts on my Melody Maker but I have found that they don’t work as well on Gibson headstock due to the headstock angle. All my other guitars (Martin, Ovation and ES137) have Grover Rotomatics. I'm fairly quick at changing strings as well. These days, I rarely break strings at gigs and even when I have, I usually just pick up the other guitar I take.
What annoys me though is when some from the younger generation tell me I'm stringing my guitars wrongly. These people are always the ones that go out of tune and breaking strings. They never stretch them either.  |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 7, 2021 14:22:44 GMT
I love the slotted Safe-T-Post tuners on my Fenders. I can change a set of strings in minutes. I ended up putting a set of vintage style Grovers with Safe-T-Posts on my Melody Maker but I have found that they don’t work as well on Gibson headstock due to the headstock angle. All my other guitars (Martin, Ovation and ES137) have Grover Rotomatics. I'm fairly quick at changing strings as well. These days, I rarely break strings at gigs and even when I have, I usually just pick up the other guitar I take.
What annoys me though is when some from the younger generation tell me I'm stringing my guitars wrongly. These people are always the ones that go out of tune and breaking strings. They never stretch them either. What the heck about your stringing technique do they take issue with??? |
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Post by johnreardon on Jan 7, 2021 14:43:11 GMT
I'm fairly quick at changing strings as well. These days, I rarely break strings at gigs and even when I have, I usually just pick up the other guitar I take.
What annoys me though is when some from the younger generation tell me I'm stringing my guitars wrongly. These people are always the ones that go out of tune and breaking strings. They never stretch them either. What the heck about your stringing technique do they take issue with??? They always think I wrap the strings around the post too many times. On Les Pauls, I wrap the string around the post before pushing it through the hole. For E, A & D strings I go leftwards and the top 3 strings I go rightwards. It may look a bit bulky, particularly for those that use locking tuners, but it works for me.
A bit like shown in this video, but I only wrap round once
You may be able to see it if you enlarge the pic of one of mine
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 7, 2021 17:15:50 GMT
Well I probably wrap the strings around the poles too many times too, especially since I use heavier strings.
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Post by infant on Jan 7, 2021 18:02:35 GMT
What the heck about your stringing technique do they take issue with??? They always think I wrap the strings around the post too many times. On Les Pauls, I wrap the string around the post before pushing it through the hole. For E, A & D strings I go leftwards and the top 3 strings I go rightwards. It may look a bit bulky, particularly for those that use locking tuners, but it works for me.
A bit like shown in this video, but I only wrap round once
You may be able to see it if you enlarge the pic of one of mine
I recall reading that BB King liked using ALL of the string. He would have a large mass of windings. So, if it was good enough for Mr King, don’t knock it! |
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Post by zontar on Jan 7, 2021 18:52:50 GMT
They always think I wrap the strings around the post too many times. On Les Pauls, I wrap the string around the post before pushing it through the hole. For E, A & D strings I go leftwards and the top 3 strings I go rightwards. It may look a bit bulky, particularly for those that use locking tuners, but it works for me.
A bit like shown in this video, but I only wrap round once
You may be able to see it if you enlarge the pic of one of mine
I recall reading that BB King liked using ALL of the string. He would have a large mass of windings. So, if it was good enough for Mr King, don’t knock it! This part of the discussion reminded me of BB King I have read that in interviews I wouldn’t recommend it-but I also wouldn’t disparage it as he did make it work |
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Post by zontar on Jan 7, 2021 19:04:52 GMT
I love the slotted Safe-T-Post tuners on my Fenders. I can change a set of strings in minutes. I ended up putting a set of vintage style Grovers with Safe-T-Posts on my Melody Maker but I have found that they don’t work as well on Gibson headstock due to the headstock angle. All my other guitars (Martin, Ovation and ES137) have Grover Rotomatics. I have wondered about that, although it works well on my Iceman I ‘ll have to compare the headstock angle |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 7, 2021 19:42:26 GMT
I have seen sometimes that the tuning post can snap when you use the holes- although luckily this has never happened to me
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Post by Sgt Rock on Jan 8, 2021 1:25:28 GMT
all of my guitars have the regular hole through the post type.
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Post by zontar on Jan 8, 2021 5:56:59 GMT
all of my guitars have the regular hole through the post type. I think most do--and I have heard of people swapping vintage tuners for regulars ones. But I like them. I wouldn't mind them on all my guitars. |
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Post by johnreardon on Jan 8, 2021 9:23:53 GMT
They always think I wrap the strings around the post too many times. On Les Pauls, I wrap the string around the post before pushing it through the hole. For E, A & D strings I go leftwards and the top 3 strings I go rightwards. It may look a bit bulky, particularly for those that use locking tuners, but it works for me.
A bit like shown in this video, but I only wrap round once
You may be able to see it if you enlarge the pic of one of mine
I recall reading that BB King liked using ALL of the string. He would have a large mass of windings. So, if it was good enough for Mr King, don’t knock it! I don't Rob, it's the younguns who keep breaking strings and going out of tune that knock it |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 8, 2021 12:40:28 GMT
I recall reading that BB King liked using ALL of the string. He would have a large mass of windings. So, if it was good enough for Mr King, don’t knock it! I don't Rob, it's the younguns who keep breaking strings and going out of tune that knock it Buncha punk kids- get off my lawn! |
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Post by zontar on Jan 9, 2021 3:38:14 GMT
I recall reading that BB King liked using ALL of the string. He would have a large mass of windings. So, if it was good enough for Mr King, don’t knock it! I don't Rob, it's the younguns who keep breaking strings and going out of tune that knock it You mean the ones that can’t tune their Guitar without a tuner? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2021 8:26:43 GMT
When I built my 59 Esquire partscaster, I used an original 1959 Telecaster neck. I'd just spent 1100.00 sending the neck to the best fretting technician I know of in the US....Mark at The Music Box in New Jersey....and had the ruined amateurishly scalloped rosewood fretboard planed off, a new rosewood fretboard installed with new clay dots and new vintage profile frets, repairs to the original finish blended in with nitro, and a fresh vintage style Fender decal applied. I had reservations about using vintage-style tuners, but wanted something that allowed the original small diameter holes to be retained and the original mounting screw holes to be used. So, I consulted the best minds on TDPRI as to which vintage-style tuners would offer the best performance while retaining the look of complete originality. Cost was no object - I just wanted the best that money could buy. The consensus was that the premium vinatge-style tuners at that time were the Gotoh SD-91's. I ordered two sets - one set for the vintage Tele neck, and the second set for my Tele build with the Rickenbacker Toaster pickups and a minty 1997 Squier Protone Strat neck. When they came in, I immediately mounted the first set to the 59 Tele neck. They looked fine....just like they grew there. While that build was proceeding, I mounted the second set to the Tele body/ Strat neck Janglecaster. When I strung that guitar up, I was thoroughly unimpressed by how poorly the tuners worked. I was used to Steinbergers, which were better than anything else on the market, so I wasn't expecting the Gotoh's to equal the performance of 120.00/set Steinbergers, but these vintage-style Gotoh's felt like crap....Lots and lots of backlash, and they didn't hold tune as well as the nasty tuners I'd pulled off Chinese Squiers. I hoped it was one bad set and that the Gotoh's on the 59 neck would be better. When I finally completed that build and strung it up, they were just as poor. I couldn't believe that people raved about these things....I mean, how important is it to be able to stick the cut end of the string down the tuner post if it means putting up with something so poor? I ended up cherry-picking the two sets of Gotoh's and putting what I thought were the best six on the Tele neck. I just set the other six aside and ordered a set of locking Sperzels for the Janglecaster. When I started setting up the 59 Esquire partscaster, the biggest problem I had with it was getting it to stay in tune. I began to wonder if my string-winding technique was so bad that I was getting string slippage because of it, so I took the guitar to the local luthier and had him install a fresh set of .010 -.046 Brite Wires on it. Took the guitar home and played with it...Same issues. I came to the conclusion that the Gotoh SD-91's are just not worth a damn. I got no joy out of playing that guitar, and when I sold it (for 1000.00 less than it cost to build) I was glad to be rid of it. I heard after the fact that the kid that bought it changed the tuners almost immediately to a set of Pings that he said were a big improvement. I don't know why people like those damn things. I don't expect a set of 69.00 Gotoh's to perform like a 120.00 set of Steinbergers but why anybody likes vintage-style tuners is beyond me.
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Post by johnreardon on Jan 9, 2021 10:01:08 GMT
I don't Rob, it's the younguns who keep breaking strings and going out of tune that knock it You mean the ones that can’t tune their GUI without a tuner? That's the ones. You would be surprise how many don't know how to tune with or without tunes |
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Post by Bill h on Jan 9, 2021 16:38:16 GMT
All but one of my guitars have the original tuners. My strat, which is the one I play the most has locking tuners. The locking tuners have been on there for over 20 years now and I’ve never had a problem with them. I gigged that guitar a lot and those locking tuners came in handy more then once.
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 9, 2021 16:59:06 GMT
When I built my 59 Esquire partscaster, I used an original 1959 Telecaster neck. I'd just spent 1100.00 sending the neck to the best fretting technician I know of in the US....Mark at The Music Box in New Jersey....and had the ruined amateurishly scalloped rosewood fretboard planed off, a new rosewood fretboard installed with new clay dots and new vintage profile frets, repairs to the original finish blended in with nitro, and a fresh vintage style Fender decal applied. I had reservations about using vintage-style tuners, but wanted something that allowed the original small diameter holes to be retained and the original mounting screw holes to be used. So, I consulted the best minds on TDPRI as to which vintage-style tuners would offer the best performance while retaining the look of complete originality. Cost was no object - I just wanted the best that money could buy. The consensus was that the premium vinatge-style tuners at that time were the Gotoh SD-91's. I ordered two sets - one set for the vintage Tele neck, and the second set for my Tele build with the Rickenbacker Toaster pickups and a minty 1997 Squier Protone Strat neck. When they came in, I immediately mounted the first set to the 59 Tele neck. They looked fine....just like they grew there. While that build was proceeding, I mounted the second set to the Tele body/ Strat neck Janglecaster. When I strung that guitar up, I was thoroughly unimpressed by how poorly the tuners worked. I was used to Steinbergers, which were better than anything else on the market, so I wasn't expecting the Gotoh's to equal the performance of 120.00/set Steinbergers, but these vintage-style Gotoh's felt like crap....Lots and lots of backlash, and they didn't hold tune as well as the nasty tuners I'd pulled off Chinese Squiers. I hoped it was one bad set and that the Gotoh's on the 59 neck would be better. When I finally completed that build and strung it up, they were just as poor. I couldn't believe that people raved about these things....I mean, how important is it to be able to stick the cut end of the string down the tuner post if it means putting up with something so poor? I ended up cherry-picking the two sets of Gotoh's and putting what I thought were the best six on the Tele neck. I just set the other six aside and ordered a set of locking Sperzels for the Janglecaster. When I started setting up the 59 Esquire partscaster, the biggest problem I had with it was getting it to stay in tune. I began to wonder if my string-winding technique was so bad that I was getting string slippage because of it, so I took the guitar to the local luthier and had him install a fresh set of .010 -.046 Brite Wires on it. Took the guitar home and played with it...Same issues. I came to the conclusion that the Gotoh SD-91's are just not worth a damn. I got no joy out of playing that guitar, and when I sold it (for 1000.00 less than it cost to build) I was glad to be rid of it. I heard after the fact that the kid that bought it changed the tuners almost immediately to a set of Pings that he said were a big improvement. I don't know why people like those damn things. I don't expect a set of 69.00 Gotoh's to perform like a 120.00 set of Steinbergers but why anybody likes vintage-style tuners is beyond me. I'm quite surprised that you have had such problem with vintage tuners. I've had both true vintage and vintage style and I've never really noticed a difference. |
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Post by Die Bullen on Jan 9, 2021 17:01:58 GMT
All but one of my guitars have the original tuners. My strat, which is the one I play the most has locking tuners. The locking tuners have been on there for over 20 years now and I’ve never had a problem with them. I gigged that guitar a lot and those locking tuners came in handy more then once. I don't tend to change tuners or either unless they are really a big problem. The lap steel i bought years back had tuners that literally wouldn't hold the strings and would slip so it was completely unplayable out of the box. Sent it back and got another one- same problem so I swapped the tuners out altogether |
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Post by Bill h on Jan 9, 2021 17:12:59 GMT
All but one of my guitars have the original tuners. My strat, which is the one I play the most has locking tuners. The locking tuners have been on there for over 20 years now and I’ve never had a problem with them. I gigged that guitar a lot and those locking tuners came in handy more then once. I don't tend to change tuners or either unless they are really a big problem. The lap steel i bought years back had tuners that literally wouldn't hold the strings and would slip so it was completely unplayable out of the box. Sent it back and got another one- same problem so I swapped the tuners out altogether There was time when I was using the whammy bar a lot and was going out if of tune more then I liked. String slip and sticking in the nut were most of the issues. I had the nut and tuners replaced at the same time and that resolved the tuning problems for the most part. |
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Post by zontar on Jan 9, 2021 22:41:56 GMT
When I built my 59 Esquire partscaster, I used an original 1959 Telecaster neck. I'd just spent 1100.00 sending the neck to the best fretting technician I know of in the US....Mark at The Music Box in New Jersey....and had the ruined amateurishly scalloped rosewood fretboard planed off, a new rosewood fretboard installed with new clay dots and new vintage profile frets, repairs to the original finish blended in with nitro, and a fresh vintage style Fender decal applied. I had reservations about using vintage-style tuners, but wanted something that allowed the original small diameter holes to be retained and the original mounting screw holes to be used. So, I consulted the best minds on TDPRI as to which vintage-style tuners would offer the best performance while retaining the look of complete originality. Cost was no object - I just wanted the best that money could buy. The consensus was that the premium vinatge-style tuners at that time were the Gotoh SD-91's. I ordered two sets - one set for the vintage Tele neck, and the second set for my Tele build with the Rickenbacker Toaster pickups and a minty 1997 Squier Protone Strat neck. When they came in, I immediately mounted the first set to the 59 Tele neck. They looked fine....just like they grew there. While that build was proceeding, I mounted the second set to the Tele body/ Strat neck Janglecaster. When I strung that guitar up, I was thoroughly unimpressed by how poorly the tuners worked. I was used to Steinbergers, which were better than anything else on the market, so I wasn't expecting the Gotoh's to equal the performance of 120.00/set Steinbergers, but these vintage-style Gotoh's felt like crap....Lots and lots of backlash, and they didn't hold tune as well as the nasty tuners I'd pulled off Chinese Squiers. I hoped it was one bad set and that the Gotoh's on the 59 neck would be better. When I finally completed that build and strung it up, they were just as poor. I couldn't believe that people raved about these things....I mean, how important is it to be able to stick the cut end of the string down the tuner post if it means putting up with something so poor? I ended up cherry-picking the two sets of Gotoh's and putting what I thought were the best six on the Tele neck. I just set the other six aside and ordered a set of locking Sperzels for the Janglecaster. When I started setting up the 59 Esquire partscaster, the biggest problem I had with it was getting it to stay in tune. I began to wonder if my string-winding technique was so bad that I was getting string slippage because of it, so I took the guitar to the local luthier and had him install a fresh set of .010 -.046 Brite Wires on it. Took the guitar home and played with it...Same issues. I came to the conclusion that the Gotoh SD-91's are just not worth a damn. I got no joy out of playing that guitar, and when I sold it (for 1000.00 less than it cost to build) I was glad to be rid of it. I heard after the fact that the kid that bought it changed the tuners almost immediately to a set of Pings that he said were a big improvement. I don't know why people like those damn things. I don't expect a set of 69.00 Gotoh's to perform like a 120.00 set of Steinbergers but why anybody likes vintage-style tuners is beyond me. I've never used Gotoh ones--at least not branded by them--mine are Fenders (probably made outside of Fender though)--and the hybrids on an Ibanez. Almost every bass I've seen has that type of tuner (But can you imagine the low string of bass & the hole through on the peg?) |
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Post by zontar on Jan 9, 2021 22:44:51 GMT
All but one of my guitars have the original tuners. My strat, which is the one I play the most has locking tuners. The locking tuners have been on there for over 20 years now and I’ve never had a problem with them. I gigged that guitar a lot and those locking tuners came in handy more then once. I've changed them on two guitars. In one case the originals had plastic casing--and some of them broke (frigid winter victims)-so the strings wouldn't stay in tune. The other was guitar I got sued, and the previous owner had replaced the original ones with enormous tuners--well enormous buttons not hem at least. Old heavy Grovers they were--and the ratio felt odd to me--so I replaced them with Schallers. If I could have found vintage style or hybrids, I probably would have used those--but no complaints on the Schallers. |
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