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Post by zontar on Jun 18, 2021 6:16:42 GMT
Why not another thread in the 5 best & worst thing series?
This time around 12 string acoustics--no specific brand or model, but in general. (I may do electric 12 strings later) Again many of the worst things are nit picky so I have 5. So no matter which brands/models you're familiar with--feel free to join in with your own comments.
First 5 best things about acoustic 12 string: 1-They sound fantastic (And this could be numbers 2-5 as well) I love the way they sound & rings out. The sound of a double course stringed instrument also attracted me to the mandolin.
2-They add another layer & flavour to your songs. 3-While they have differences from a 6 string, if you can play 6 string you already know a lot of stuff you need to learn 12 string--notes, chords, scales, melodies, etc--yes there is some learning curve-but you've got a great headstart. 4-You are less likely to have someone else playing you that occupies the exact same sonic space. Unless they show up with an acoustic 12 string. 5-They make you look cool--because--hey you can play one (As long as you can play it) In any case it can impress others--look at how many strings you have, etc.
5 worst- 1-String changes they take at least twice as long--maybe more 2-Tuning is trickier -more strings to tune--and often the tuning pegs are closer together, and it's easier to change the wrong string--and just in general it can be tougher. 3-String spacing can be tighter--which is tricky for some. 4-Hard to bend strings--and for someone who loves bending strings--even in chord playing-- that can be tricky. 5-Often the bodies are large--and for some people that can be a hinderance to playing them.
Anything I missed? Am I out to lunch on any of this?
And hey, I do love my 12 string (Simon & Patrick Woodland Cedar)
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Post by johnreardon on Jun 18, 2021 9:40:07 GMT
Never had a 12 string and never will. 6 strings are enough for me.
I suppose they have a jangle sound that can be nice, but to be honest I don't like them. I used to play in a folk band where the lead singer always played a 12 string. She used to annoy me as most times, a 6 string would have sounded better.
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Post by infant on Jun 18, 2021 12:43:58 GMT
I agree with pretty much everything Zontar said above. My parents bought me a Harmony 12 string back in 1971 when we were visiting Italy. I sold it a few years later to buy an Ovation 6 string but Iโve been kinda looking at possibly getting another 12 string over the last couple of years and the S&P and Seagulls are great instruments.
The jangle and the fuller sound of a 12 string are incredible but like Zontar also stated, string changes are a b!tch! Also, the cost of strings is almost double the cost of regular 6 string acoustic ones. My Harmony had a very wide neck which made it difficult to play but I still managed. They were also difficult to tune back when I owned mine as it was before digital tuners so it was all done by ear. I used to play in a folk choir at our church where two of us had 12 string guitars and for some reason, after we would all tune up, the two 12 strings always sounded slightly out of tune with each other. Body was the size of a regular dreadnaught and although it was my first good acoustic guitar, I thought they were all big like that. It was a big difference when I sold it and bought my Ovation acoustic with concert sized body and slim electric guitar-like neck. When I bought my Martin D-16, I found it hard to get used to the dread body and slightly wider neck again.
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Post by Die Bullen on Jun 18, 2021 13:28:56 GMT
Yeah I tend to agree. I had a yamaha 12 string years ago. Nice sound but restringing was a pain. The neck thickness never bothered me and I like large bodied guitars anyway. I probably wouldn't buy another one unless it was carbon fiber
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Post by Bill h on Jun 18, 2021 16:58:05 GMT
Donโt like 12 strings myself, I guess restringing them is a pain but I just donโt like the sound of them.
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Post by zontar on Jun 19, 2021 5:53:44 GMT
Well I did share this in the Quotes about guitar thread. But it fits here as well:
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2021 18:34:25 GMT
I always have a 12 string. Right now itโs an electric but I have owned many acoustics. There is no reason a 12 string canโt stay in tune. If it doesnโt get rid of it and get a better one. I like to play rhythm guitar in a group. A 12 string played in the back of the mix fills out the sound and improves the song. Full tone bends can be hard but for blues semitone bends which push the double strings slightly out of tune sound great. Slide on a 12 string has a haunting sound perfect for minor keys.
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Post by zontar on Jul 12, 2021 6:56:01 GMT
I would love an electric 12 string.
maybe one day.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2021 1:08:46 GMT
All but two of my 12 string guitars has been electric. The first one was a Takamine acoustic that played nicely, but sounded out of tune played above the fifth fret, so it was only viable for cowboy chords. It went back where it was purchased a few days later in favour of an electric 12 string (a Mastumoku-built Toledo 335-style guitar). I owned one other acoustic 12 string, which I bought on a whim...an Ovation...and like all of my 12 string guitars, it was a fascinating toy for a few days but quickly became a case queen that didn't get played.
All of my 12 strings suffered from the same basic complaint....Almost all 12 strings except Rickenbackers and Fenders utilize a bridge where pairs of strings share the same saddle, and therein lies the problem - There's always an intonation issue when a thick string and a thin string share the same saddle position, and they sound crappy played further up the neck.
If I ever get another 12 string, it'll be a Rickenbacker or Fender electric with individual string saddles. But quite honestly, the Digitech Mosaic satisfies what I generally want from a 12 string without the discomfort of too-wide necks, tough string bending, excessive time tuning, and the too-narrow spacing between pairs of strings. I don't ever imagine wanting another 12 string acoustic.
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Post by zontar on Jul 25, 2021 6:40:37 GMT
All but two of my 12 string guitars has been electric. The first one was a Takamine acoustic that played nicely, but sounded out of tune played above the fifth fret, so it was only viable for cowboy chords. It went back where it was purchased a few days later in favour of an electric 12 string (a Mastumoku-built Toledo 335-style guitar). I owned one other acoustic 12 string, which I bought on a whim...an Ovation...and like all of my 12 string guitars, it was a fascinating toy for a few days but quickly became a case queen that didn't get played. All of my 12 strings suffered from the same basic complaint....Almost all 12 strings except Rickenbackers and Fenders utilize a bridge where pairs of strings share the same saddle, and therein lies the problem - There's always an intonation issue when a thick string and a thin string share the same saddle position, and they sound crappy played further up the neck. If I ever get another 12 string, it'll be a Rickenbacker or Fender electric with individual string saddles. But quite honestly, the Digitech Mosaic satisfies what I generally want from a 12 string without the discomfort of too-wide necks, tough string bending, excessive time tuning, and the too-narrow spacing between pairs of strings. I don't ever imagine wanting another 12 string acoustic. I'd love to have an electric 12. In way I find a 12 string electric is more a different beast than a 6 string electric than the same thing in acoustic guitars. But I will always love acoustic 12 strings. and I may do a list like this for electric 12 strings at some point.
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Post by george on Jul 27, 2021 2:52:35 GMT
Never owned a 12 string but 3 of my friends have them although I havenโt seen those people in years .. lol
They donโt suit my playing style.
Saw 12 string Fender strat once and played it for a minute after the owner handed it to me when I was talking to him between sets. He had a story about the guitar but I canโt remember what he said.
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Post by zontar on Jul 28, 2021 7:17:11 GMT
Never owned a 12 string but 3 of my friends have them although I havenโt seen those people in years .. lol They donโt suit my playing style. Saw 12 string Fender strat once and played it for a minute after the owner handed it to me when I was talking to him between sets. He had a story about the guitar but I canโt remember what he said. I've played a couple of 12 string Strats--if I'd had the cash when I saw either one--I would have bought it.
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Post by markr on Aug 2, 2021 21:32:22 GMT
I have a Norman B-20 12 string with a built in PU and I love it! Just have to spend time with a 12 string and change your playing style a bit.
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Post by zontar on Aug 2, 2021 23:18:52 GMT
I have a Norman B-20 12 string with a built in PU and I love it! Just have to spend time with a 12 string and change your playing style a bit. I find I change at least little things with different guitars due to neck size & shop, fret size & height, etc. But yeah 12 strings are a different beast that way. And I love playing mine as well. Even if dread sized guitars are not that comfortable for me. For my 12 string I put up with it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2021 16:00:35 GMT
If there's one thing that pretty much all 12 string's suffer from, it's that they're a one-trick pony. Electric 12 strings have the advantage of more control via amplifier settings, but once you've heard an acoustic 12 string, not much is going to change.
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Post by markr on Aug 16, 2021 11:44:04 GMT
If there's one thing that pretty much all 12 string's suffer from, it's that they're a one-trick pony. Electric 12 strings have the advantage of more control via amplifier settings, but once you've heard an acoustic 12 string, not much is going to change. That one trick is great, I may only have one trick as well!
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Post by zontar on Aug 20, 2021 6:17:14 GMT
If there's one thing that pretty much all 12 string's suffer from, it's that they're a one-trick pony. Electric 12 strings have the advantage of more control via amplifier settings, but once you've heard an acoustic 12 string, not much is going to change. I don't know--I've heard all sorts of stuff done on a 12 string--chords, single notes, slide, folk, pop, jazz, rock, gospel, blues, and on & on. Not sure what you mean by one trick pony, and even if it is--why is that a bad thing? Just wondering...
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Post by highdeaf on Aug 20, 2021 14:35:43 GMT
Watching SRV tear it up on a 12 string is very entertaining. But it is SRV!
I own 17 guitars and none of them have 12 strings. It's not my thang. But I get why some people love them.
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Post by zontar on Aug 22, 2021 8:17:20 GMT
Watching SRV tear it up on a 12 string is very entertaining. But it is SRV! I own 17 guitars and none of them have 12 strings. It's not my thang. But I get why some people love them. I've seen video of that show--and he does a greta job acoustically. it doesn't slow him down at all. and it still sounds like SRV.
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Post by zontar on Oct 11, 2021 23:51:08 GMT
One of the best things (or rather persons)
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Post by laristotle on Oct 12, 2021 8:16:09 GMT
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Post by highdeaf on Oct 26, 2021 13:44:09 GMT
The five worst things on (some) twelve strings is changing strings 1 thru 5. I'll leave you to figure out what the other 7 are.
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Post by zontar on Oct 28, 2021 5:25:28 GMT
The five worst things on (some) twelve strings is changing strings 1 thru 5. I'll leave you to figure out what the other 7 are. I did mention string changes on my list as well. And I recently did change the strings on mine.
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Post by markr on Oct 28, 2021 11:51:28 GMT
I changed the strings and the pickup in my Norman B-20 and last night I played it through a tube Art preamp with built in compressor. I added a little hall reverb and it was all worth it!
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Post by zontar on Oct 30, 2021 7:48:25 GMT
I changed the strings and the pickup in my Norman B-20 and last night I played it through a tube Art preamp with built in compressor. I added a little hall reverb and it was all worth it! It may be worth it, but that doesn't mean I have to enjoy the process.
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Post by zontar on Jan 5, 2022 1:08:57 GMT
Picture of my Simon & Patrick Woodland cedar 12 string the same day I bought this Tom Jackson was also buying an acoustic. We were trying them out in the same room at the same time. But I was in there first. I doubt he remembers me.
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Post by markr on Jan 5, 2022 12:07:59 GMT
Picture of my Simon & Patrick Woodland cedar 12 string the same day I bought this Tom Jackson was also buying an acoustic. We were trying them out in the same room at the same time. But I was in there first. I doubt he remembers me. Weird, not much different than my Norman B-20?๐ My B-20 is spruce I believe.
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Post by zontar on Jan 12, 2022 4:05:11 GMT
Picture of my Simon & Patrick Woodland cedar 12 string the same day I bought this Tom Jackson was also buying an acoustic. We were trying them out in the same room at the same time. But I was in there first. I doubt he remembers me. Weird, not much different than my Norman B-20?๐ My B-20 is spruce I believe. The Godin brands have a look to them. Nice guitars
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bruce
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Post by bruce on Dec 28, 2022 19:32:42 GMT
No style of guitar can do everything. I look at them as more of a paintbrush. A 12 string can paint a colour like no other. I have a seagull 12 with a built in tuner which makes tuning easy. When itโs time to restring I buy high end strings cause they last longer and on a 12 Iโm not bending like I do so that wear n tear is minimal. I pull the 12 out about once a month and it always puts a smile on my face on the 1st big Chang.
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Post by edwardbloom on Mar 16, 2023 1:43:52 GMT
i met a player once who said he didn't like hendrix. i was pretty surprised, and asked why. he said "take "hear my train a'comin, for example...he plays a 3rd of the song before he chooses a key". i thought that was pretty funny, it's the only part of the conversation i remember. i learned on a 12 string ricky. years ago i had a 12 string acoustic for a while. except, i didn't play it as a 12 string. i played it as an 11 string because, the last e is redundant, afaic. i wouldn't mind having another 11 string acoustic, but before that, i have to buy a rosewood tele.
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